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Allch Chcar

Growth Energy anti-misinformation campaign

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Is anyone working on campaigns like this? I read the responses in the Baltimore Sun to their comment regarding an article and it was like stepping into a troll den.  :o  :confused:

 

View web version.

 

TUESDAY, SEPTEMBER 06, 2011

 

Dear Friend,

 

Over the Holiday weekend, our critics continued their misleading attacks on ethanol.

 

In Saturday’s Wall Street Journal, Nestlé CEO, Peter Brabeck-Letmathe, suggested that America’s ethanol policy is causing people to go hungry, in the article, Can the World Still Feed Itself?

 

Similar claims about grain ethanol’s impact on food scarcity were posted in Biofuels: Better later than sooner, on the blog, Collegiate Climate Collaboration.

 

And elsewhere, a letter published in Saturday’s Post Crescent (Appleton, Wis.), used sweeping generalizations to distort the truth about ethanol's fuel properties and the role it plays in fostering our energy independence.

 

This is not the first time that our critics have willfully attempted to confuse the public on ethanol.

 

The truth is that grains used in ethanol go back into the food supply in the form of a highly-valued animal feed at cheaper prices than corn. It actually helps keep food and fuel costs low. American ethanol uses less than 3 percent of the world’s total grain supply. And, domestic ethanol is the single-best alternative to foreign oil we have today.

 

We have already responded to these attacks with letters to the editor and online comments. Please help us correct these false statements by logging on to the Wall Street Journal, Collegiate Climate Collaboration and Post Crescent websites and posting a comment.

 

Here are some suggested bullet points:

 

Food vs. Fuel is a myth. Countless academic, economic and government studies have disproven the idea, concluding that Wall Street speculators, high oil prices and the high costs of manufacturing, packaging and transporting all have far more impact than ethanol on the grocery prices that everyday Americans pay.

Ethanol production produces both renewable fuel and animal feed in the form of high-protein distiller’s grains; approximately a third of every bushel of grain that goes into ethanol is returned in animal feed.

Grain ethanol producers are leading the way toward next generation fuels like cellulosic ethanol, which promise to reduce harmful emissions by as much as 100 percent relative to gasoline refined from oil.

In 2010, ethanol reduced imports by 445 million barrels of oil — more oil than we import from Saudi Arabia. And America's ethanol industry helped reduce farm subsidy payments by $10.1 billion, added $53.6 billion to the economy and reduced gas prices by $34.5 billion.

Opening the fuels market to more ethanol – through Flex Fuel pumps and Flex Fuel vehicles – will help our nation achieve its energy security goals and send the signals needed to bring the next generation of ethanol to commercialization.

Sincerely,

Chris Thorne

Public Affairs Director, Growth Energy

 

Growth Energy represents the producers and supporters of ethanol who feed the world and fuel America in ways that achieve energy independence, improve economic well-being and create a healthier environment for all Americans now!

 

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Growth Energy | 777 North Capitol Street, NE, Suite 805 | Washington, DC 20002

info@growthenergy.org | 202.545.4000

 

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"like stepping into a troll den".... well, about as good as a description as there could be...

 

You find the same thing over on "gasbuddy"... the ethanolphobes out there (be they of the food/vs/food falsehood, environmental falsehood, or of the mechanical falsehood variates) are tough to deal with.  They have their preconceived mis-perceptions (based on years of lies spread as though they were truth)... and supported by either anecdotal evidence (a buddy of mine...) or irrational over generalizations.

 

Any effort to try to sway them from their false position, only causes them to dig in more, and to begin lashing out at you as though YOU were the one spreading lies and mis-informed...

 

Some of these "trolls" really get under my skin.  I guess I shouldn't let them, but intimidating people like me from adding to the discussion and prompting people to think is the reason they act the way they do.

 

For my own health (blood pressure and overall anxiety) I tend to steer clear of "troll dens"...  Though when I'm feeling really upbeat and full of P&V... I'll do my duty.

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I don't like to refer to people as trolls, forums might be "troll dens" but that doesn't make all members trolls. But when large numbers of them are being abusive and ignorant it becomes really hard to listen to anything they say. And the conversation doesn't benefit anyone involved or reading.

 

I tried to post on the forums that were bashing Ethanol in topics but riddled with bad information and that didn't work too well. I was flamed or laughed or simply put on ignore for pushing the issue. It frustrates me aswell which doesn't improve my posting quality. :-[

 

I have noticed that forums which are infamous for their members' behavior like Honda-tech and NASIOC are shockingly more pro-Ethanol members and topics than some of the Mustang forums I have been to :o. Something about results speaking volumes.

 

As for reaching people about Ethanol. I try to chat with people on forums who are not outright against Ethanol but aren't supportive either. I find these kinds of people are more receptive to listening and discussing Ethanol as a fuel in cars, which is far more beneficial to everyone who listens. It at least gets people talking about it.

 

The fact that Corn Ethanol isn't the most efficient source doesn't help. And the fact that Ethanol plants push for more Ethanol additive in Gasoline when they could be pushing more for the new Renewable fuels standard and mandating FFVs.

 

It would be a lot easier to discuss E85 if it wasn't fairy juice compared to Gasoline. Most car forums that I frequent would need have an E85 conversion with a write up similar to a turbo build before people would even consider E85 as an option.

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The fact that Corn Ethanol isn't the most efficient source doesn't help. And the fact that Ethanol plants push for more Ethanol additive in Gasoline when they could be pushing more for the new Renewable fuels standard and mandating FFVs.

 

 

 

Thanks Allch Chcar ..now I don't need to go on another rant about Corn Ethanol shooting itself in the butt again  ;D

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The fact that Corn Ethanol isn't the most efficient source doesn't help. And the fact that Ethanol plants push for more Ethanol additive in Gasoline when they could be pushing more for the new Renewable fuels standard and mandating FFVs.

 

 

 

Thanks Allch Chcar ..now I don't need to go on another rant about Corn Ethanol shooting itself in the butt again  ;D

 

No problem Dan!  8)

 

I can appreciate Corn Ethanol being cheap and easy and available now but I agree that we are going to need more and better sources to make a dent in Oil consumption  :-\.

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I grew tired of arguing with willfully ignorant idiots online a while ago. Now I am on a quest to prove things rather than argue with them. I am attacking all the myths, food v fuel, corrosion, and economy at the same time. My biggest problem is I am one guy and I have other things I need to do outside the fuel project. When it is done, then they wont be able to say much bad about it, and they will have proof that it doesnt hurt cars, even old ones, and it makes more power while getting better mileage. I will figure out how to do all of that, and if they dont like it or think its all lies, well they can enjoy the $5+ gas that we all know is coming.

 

What that means is I have better things to do that argue with idiots, though occasionally I will go fishing for people who are curious or actually want accurate information about it.

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Thumpn...

 

I still think that Growth Energy or someone should be "sponsoring" you... help get your experiment going... get you out to some local events... maybe try replicating some of these modifications with others in other ethanol heavy states....

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Thumpn...

 

I still think that Growth Energy or someone should be "sponsoring" you... help get your experiment going... get you out to some local events... maybe try replicating some of these modifications with others in other ethanol heavy states....

 

It would be nice if they would, I dont see it happening since most people think I am a nutter. Ive tried to get some companies to help me out, but usually I get the brush off from them. You would think that if someone was willig to do R&D to improve mileage and power with your EFI system, you would help them out with the project. So far nobody wants in on it. So it goes along as I can afford it.

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