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Guest spott98

Dallas Texas E85

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Guest spott98

Price at Kroger was $1.79 today (Sunday, November 12) (regular was @ $2.04) but neither pump was working.  I was a little bothered by this and will be calling in the morning to do some follow-up (Mechanical, no product, ....??)

 

I've been reading for a couple of days now and am getting very interested in the possibilities.

 

 

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Sorry Guys ...

 

spott98 is gone.  In his place the SpottedCow will be doing the talking ....  OK, It's really just me (spott98)  I realized that this user name has brought me a lot more fun and joy than that old (spott98) one ever did.

 

I just moved to TX, from Vancouver, WA and am excited to give this E85 stuff a try.  (There was none available in my area there)

 

I'm driving a 2006 Ford F-150 Supercab with the 5.4L Triton V8

 

More later

 

'Cow

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Sorry Guys ...

 

spott98 is gone.  In his place the SpottedCow will be doing the talking ....  OK, It's really just me (spott98)  I realized that this user name has brought me a lot more fun and joy than that old (spott98) one ever did.

 

I just moved to TX, from Vancouver, WA and am excited to give this E85 stuff a try.  (There was none available in my area there)

 

I'm driving a 2006 Ford F-150 Supercab with the 5.4L Triton V8

 

More later

 

'Cow

 

Any chance you'll miss winter ?  ;)

 

Texas is a huge Oil State so I was suprised when E85 started up in Texas this past year .  Even more suprised that it is priced relatively well considering the Oil influence in the state and that Texas needs to import most of it's ethanol.  BurnAlcohol one of our Mods lives in Nebraska the largest Ethanol producer and until just recently the price of E85 was well over the price of unleaded ..go figure

 

Welcome aboard

 

Just so you know I take all the Prices posted here and update them over at our sister site  e85prices.com , your free to post them thie also if you like

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Price confirmed.

 

The pumps are now working at Krogers @ MacArthur and the 635 (never did get a hold of anyone that could tell me what was wrong) I have gone green for the first time and filled my truck with [glow=red,2,300]E85[/glow].

 

Price was $1.79 while the "cheep" stuff (E10) was $2.15  It sure looks like that's worth it to me, but we'll see what kinds of things I run into with mileage and power.

 

Wish me luck!!

 

'Cow

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Price confirmed.

 

The pumps are now working at Krogers @ MacArthur and the 635 (never did get a hold of anyone that could tell me what was wrong) I have gone green for the first time and filled my truck with [glow=red,2,300]E85[/glow].

 

Price was $1.79 while the "cheep" stuff (E10) was $2.15  It sure looks like that's worth it to me, but we'll see what kinds of things I run into with mileage and power.

 

Wish me luck!!

 

'Cow

 

Congrats !      And $1.79 against $2.15 thats not bad either

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I'm back!!!  Filled up again last night, and the price has skyrocketed to $1.89!!!  LOL  Still not bad considering that regular E10 is up to $2.19 :o

 

OK, so I drove 198.9 miles, and filled up with 18.034 gal  So this last tank full got me  11.029 miles to the gal.  I'm not so sure how accurate that really is because of my driving habits, I really wanted to see if I could feel a difference in power and several hard accelerations on the freeway on-ramps confirmed a "small" drop off in the get up and go, but overall I'm very happy about the performance.

 

This tank should be more realistic, I'll slow down, and I go back to work on Monday (month and a half of unemployment was driving me CRAZY) So back to a regular driving schedule .....  read, it won't take me so long until I have to fill up again.

 

But at least I'm GREEN !!!

 

'Cow

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I'm back!!!  Filled up again last night, and the price has skyrocketed to $1.89!!!  LOL  Still not bad considering that regular E10 is up to $2.19 :o

 

OK, so I drove 198.9 miles, and filled up with 18.034 gal  So this last tank full got me  11.029 miles to the gal.  I'm not so sure how accurate that really is because of my driving habits, I really wanted to see if I could feel a difference in power and several hard accelerations on the freeway on-ramps confirmed a "small" drop off in the get up and go, but overall I'm very happy about the performance.

 

This tank should be more realistic, I'll slow down, and I go back to work on Monday (month and a half of unemployment was driving me CRAZY) So back to a regular driving schedule .....  read, it won't take me so long until I have to fill up again.

 

But at least I'm GREEN !!!

 

'Cow

 

Good to hear spotted.

 

You know in reality you are looking at around a .40 spread between E85 and Unleaded  ..If e10 is $2.19 then realunleaded is probably $2.29 ?       

 

.40 cent spread just about any vehicle is coming out a head using e85 and like you said .. you're GREEN now !

 

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Filled up again.  Price of E-85 is @ $1.85  Regular gas is @ $2.15  Ok, I'm saving $.30 a gallon which is about 14% savings, however my MPG is at 10.5, compared to my gas MPG of 14 is down ~ 25% ...... So this green thing is actually costing me 10% more!!??  Any tips on tuning for better efficiencies, or is this what's to be expected?  ???

 

Again, I have a 2006 Ford F-150 with the 5.4L V8  I'm not expecting to get 25MPG, but to break even would be nice.

 

'Cow

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Spotted cow wondered about better tuning---read this.

 

Quote from: jlawren6 on November 09, 2006, 08:56:23 AM

tschaid,

 

Could you explain a little more what about the Ford factory E85 tuning you felt made it inefficent?  Also, I've read that the factory tuning gives a 5% power increase when using E85, but have never found the original source for this.  I know that you've reasearched this extensively.  Can you shed any light on that?

 

The reasons for my questions is that I have an 06 F150 5.4L FFV (RYB3) and I've been looking into getting an aftermarket performance tuner for it (xcal2 or edge).  I'd really like to run predominantly E85 in it, however, as there are several stations near me that carry it now.  From what I've read, the factory tuning adjust the fuel delivery and timing based on the percentage of ethanol in the fuel that is indicated by a sensor in the fuel system.  With an aftermarket programmer, however, I was concerned that I would lose this adapability because their programs would be dialed in for one specific fuel octane rating.  With E85, this is espeically a problem due to the changing octane ratings from winter to summer mixes.  In my mind, with either the xcal2 or edge, I would have to have several custom programs for the various octane ratings depending on the time of year. Actually, I'm not sure exactly how you would know what octane rating I had on a particular fillup.  There seems to be such a wide available range in the E85 mix (from 70% up to 85% ethanol per the pump stickers).

 

Any info you could provide would be appreciated.  Thanks.

 

Jon

 

Jon,

 

You have touched on quite a number of points.  First let's talk about the XCal2 and the Edge.  It seems to me you have been or are on F150Online.  If so, you have seen quite a number of my posts over there including responses from the Superchips Distribtutor flaming me.  He & I had a real good relationship until he did not respond to issues with the Xcal2 telling me he owed me nothing.  This started the bad blood.  Of course, that was also before my conversion to E85 of my 2004 F150.  Still, he is easily the best F150 tuner in the business.  In fact, I don't really believe anybody compares in research & testing, etc.  When I began this project, I spoke with Rob Story at Edge to determine if the Edge would allow me the control I was looking for.  Rob was honest and upfront telling me it would not.  So, that is the history.

 

Now... to try to answer your questions.  If you have the skill or want to gain the skill, the best approach to tuning your vehicle is to do it yourself.  How ?  For about $250 you can purchase the SCT Pro Racer Software and for another $350 you can purchase the XCAL2 programmer.  This will then allow you to reprogam your vehicle at will.

 

Comparing a custom tune to the factory tune is really quite easy.  Remember, the mfgr is required by law to tune a vehicle to satisfy a number of criteria.  The first is fuel economy as it pertains to gasoline.  They do not; however, have to tune a vehicle to burn E70 or E85 efficiently.  But, let's take a quick look at some of the specifics.  I have analyzed RYB2, even loading many of the parameters from RYB2 (2006 FFV) into my 2004 F150.  You are correct, Ford has built in controls that are utilized when E85 is sensed in the fuel delivery system.  They have not optimized the ignition timing and they have not optimized the fuel economy under either E85 or gasoline.  The transmission shift points have way too much overlap.  A high percentage of Ethyl Alcohol provides us with some very cool possiblilities when tuning these trucks.  First, Alcohol burns at an easy 200 degrees cooler than gasoline.  Second, the emissions results from Alcohol are significantly below even California requirements.  This allows tuning to a leaner burn.  The accepted air to fuel ratio for E85 is around 9.85 air to 1 fuel.  This will result in fuel economy at least 2 MPG below what is possible.  By raising this from to between 10.8 & 11.8 to 1, you engine will still operate below the temp when burning gasoline and you emissions will still be far below California requirements.

 

Now, let's talk about Octane Ratings.  E85 Ethanol is specific at 105 Octane.  E85 is generally blended by using 110 Octane 100% Ethly Alochol and 15% 85 or 87 Octane Gasoline.  By raising the percentage of Gasoline, you are in fact lowering the Octane Rating of the fuel.  But...  no tuner should ever advance the timing to dial in 105 Octane because no real benefit occurs after around 100 Octane from what I have seen.  That being said, the experienced tuner advances timing only to the point where maximum speed is achieved in elapsed time.

 

This has already become a long winded response.  Send me an e-mail with your e-mail address and I would be happy to explain much more.  I promised to write an article for Dan several months ago; but, am so so busy I just haven't had the time.  I will absolutely write the article and present it to Dan in the near future; but, for now... I would be happy to exchange e-mail messages with you if you are interested in the specific details about the tuning of these vehicles.  My truck, over 105,000 miles, has just exceeded 16,500 since converting it to run on E85 and I could not be happier with the performance.  My truck is heavily modified; but, I expect to see 200K, 300K primarily due to the cleaner burning of E85.  It is a superior fuel.

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