Topic: EPA OKs E15 for Sale at U.S. Gas Stations

[rusty70f100]

I have yet to see an engine, carbureted or fuel injected, that won't run on E20.  So E15 should be fine.  In fact, my old '87 Ford gets better mileage on E20 than it does on E0 or E10, and runs better too.  I've since converted it to E85, but I put many miles on it on E20.

I think your Chrysler will be just fine.

[BJoe]

The 4.0l version of that engine has always been multipoint EFI from when AMC was still mostly owned by Renault all the way through to the point at which the TJ/LJ Wranglers died in favor of the JK's during Daimler's pillaging of Chrysler.  Oddly enough, Dad also said he thought TBI injection systems wouldn't work well on Ethanol during that conversation below.  I'm kind of curious where the study mentioned by Dan sourced the test vehicles from, why they removed the engine to test it instead of using a chassis dyno to test the whole system as factory installed, ect.

[Thumpin455]

E15 wont hurt a carbed car unless it is tuned to the ragged edge of lean, most arent. Even then it wont hurt the engine, it will just not run well. Surging, stutter, running hotter in some cases, all the typical lean things.

As for ethanol hurting engines, that really makes me laugh and wonder what the people saying it have been smoking. Or it makes me question their knowledge of engines and vehicles in general. Considering how much cleaner they run, no carbon buildup, no black oil after a change, and the cooler operation compared to gas it is a wonderful fuel. If it dies after running ethanol from a mechanical failure, it was on its way out already or you spun it too high in RPM and exceeded the design limits.

I have a 99 Blazer that doesnt like more than E30, and on that it doesnt run well. Its a TBI injected 4.3L, and it is probably something to do with the system itself and the 130k+ miles it has. It doesnt mind 15% at all, but over 20% it starts getting weird about it. Its the only vehicle I have that has an issue with less than 50%.

[BJoe]

The only vehicles I'd worry about with e15 would be vehicles w/o fuel injection.

Funny you say that, I was talking to my Dad about possibly running my XJ on 15% (he put nearly 300k hard earned miles on the two second hand XJ's he had, total combined miles when they were scrapped neared 500k!) and he figured with the 4.0l being injected instead of carbed, it would probably be ok.  With mine being a '98, I just wasn't sure since there were changes on the top ends of those motors in the last years of the platform's life and maybe in the programing of the computers.

Cessna, I've worked retail for 20 years as of this August, the ignorance of people, including those who are very well educated and bring home more money in a week than I make in a month or more, sadly no longer surprises me.

[TD]

The only vehicles I'd worry about with e15 would be vehicles w/o fuel injection.

[cessna]

I hope the chemicals you use do not have Neonicotoinoids in them.

Just Roundup and some volunteer corn killer. I have a building sight close to town that a guy has had bee's located for the last 10 years. We even spray for soybean aphids and so far his bee's must be thriving because he gives me about 4 or 5 gallons of honey a year.This idea E15 is killing engines just shows how stupid people are. I'd tell people that believe that study that you're surprised they were able to pass their driver's license test.

[BJoe]

I tried asking on the Cherokee owners forum I've been on for a while and somebody has already brought up that study of the E-15's ability to kill engines.........I'm waiting to get called a baby killer and traitor there by the wingnuts now

[85racer]

it ran fine two days ago when I was running around getting farm chemicals to spray on the soybeans.

I hope the chemicals you use do not have Neonicotoinoids in them. Neonicotoinoids is what is killing off the honeybee. With out honeybees, no pollination, less yields, higher Ethanol.

[cessna]

Would there be anything special that I would need to do to a mid-late 90's vehicle to make 15% work?

No, I have a 1992 Toyota 4x4 with 22R-E engine and it has had mostly E50 for the last eleven years----it ran fine two days ago when I was running around getting farm chemicals to spray on the soybeans.

[BJoe]

Would there be anything special that I would need to do to a mid-late 90's vehicle to make 15% work?  Besides the 200, I've also got a '98 Cherokee with a 4.0l I-6 that has 156k miles of 0%-10% usage and somewhat of a rear main seal leak (which is normal for it's mileage)  and I wouldn't mind using 15% in it if it becomes available around here.

[Dan M]

WASHINGTON -- U.S. Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) has removed the last federal regulatory barrier standing in the way of bringing E15 (gasoline-ethanol blends containing up to 15% ethanol)to retail consumers, said the Petroleum Marketers Association of America (PMAA) in a news alert.
[/color]The Renewable Fuels Association successfully removed the last barrier standing when it addressed the EPA's remaining concern about potential consumer misfueling due to residual E15 left in the hose of a blender pump that also dispenses E10 product. The RFA said it will incorporate procedures to prevent residual misfueling in its E15 retailer handbook. With its concerns fully addressed, the EPA marked the end of a three-year approval process by giving E15 the green light, said PMAA.
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[/color]The EPA's final approval of misfueling mitigation measures does not mean E15 will arrive at retail stations anytime soon, it added, "as significant hurdles remain."PMAA said, "Consumer concerns about potential engine damage and marketer worries over misfueling liability are just the tip of the iceberg preventing the widespread introduction of E15 in the marketplace. A far larger hurdle to overcome for the E15 industry is the myriad of state regulatory issues that must first be resolved before E15 makes it to retail pumps. These issues include UST equipment and dispenser compatibility, state fuel quality assurance requirements, consumer protection, fire code and weights and measure standards as well as state OSHA rules. Clearing these hurdles will likely involve a lengthy process in states where regulators remain concerned about E15 and its potential impact on equipment, workplace safety, consumer protection and the environment."Until now, no U.S. company could sell a gasoline-ethanol blend that contained more than 10% ethanol to most conventional gasoline-fueled vehicles, added a report by The Des Moines Register. Most gasoline sold in the United States is a mix of 10% ethanol.
http://www.cspnet.com/news/fuels/articles/epa-oks-e15-sale-us-gas-stations